What is the definition of a "redraw"?

Question

Very simple question...

When people talk about outs and card odds they often will something to the like of, "i have about 4 outs not counting redraws" - what defines a redraw?

If it matters, I am asking within the context of Texas Hold'em.

Answer 1

A redraw generally tends to mean that you have the best hand, and you have a draw to another better hand. In Texas Hold 'Em, the best example would be a set on the flop. If you get all-in against a flush draw, even though they have a draw to a better hand (a flush), you have a re-draw to a hand that can beat their draw (a full house). The term is more useful in an Omaha type game, where 2 players can frequently hold the same hand (e.g. a nut straight), but one can have a redraw to a nut flush or full house.

Answer 2

Say you have two pair on the flop and your opponent has a flush draw.

On the turn they hit their flush and you don't improve; you have a redraw to a full house.

Answer 3

Let's say you have A hearts, K hearts in your hand.

The flop comes up A spades and two small diamonds. One of your opponents bets heavily. It's likely that he has one of the following:

Two pair

A set

Four to a diamond flush.

If he has two pair, say "matching" the ace and a small diamond, in his hand, you have three OUTS to a better two pair (the three kings).

If he has a set with one of the small cards, you have two OUTS to a better set (the two aces).

If he has two small diamonds, any diamond on the turn will the flush. But either the ace of diamonds or the king of diamonds will make you a three aces, or two pair (aces and kings), giving you a REDRAW to a full house (which beats his flush) on the river card. A small diamond would not.

Answer 4

Answer from Chris is correct (in my opinion)

Redraw only applies with two cards to come

If there is only one card to come you merely kill outs. Say villain is on an open ended straight draw and hero is ahead and on a flush draw then hero has killed two outs. So instead of 8 outs villain has 6.

With two cards to come
Hero Q♥Q⋄ Villain 5♣4♣ Board Q♠J♣T♣
First you kill outs - the Q♣ is not good so villain only has 8 outs
Hero has 6 outs on the J T and any runner club with matching rank
So 3♣ with any other 3 not good
Hero basically has 9 kills to any of the 8 outs
There are 45 cards left, 8 outs, and 9 kills
Not exact but just discount the (good) outs 8 * (1 - 9/45) = 8 * 36/45 = 6.4
With redraw villain is 27%
Without the redraw villain was 33%
If hero has 9 kills (redraws) take away about 20% of the villain hand odds
Take away about 2% for each redraw (not as in subtract but multiply)
Hero implied odds are better as if you both hit you should get action

Exact math:
Using combinations with 45 (52 -2 -2 -3) cards left
there are 990 two cards combinations
good club club combinations = 8*7/2 = 28
other combinations = 8 * (45 -8 -9) = 224 (the -9 is the redraws)
(28 + 224) / 990 = 0.2545 = 25% = 2.9 : 1

Trips against a flush or open ended straight draw then villain goes from a 2:1 to a 3:1 dog
If you know your math you can use use this get an edge

Two pair is much different
Now hero only has 4 kills (redraws) rather than 9
In is case villain would be 0.2949 = 29% = 2.4:1

In this example hero does not know if they are also against a straight or straight draw so it would be messy.

Answer 5

Ok. I've played poker for 30 yrs, and in over 60 styles/variations. A "re-draw" is almost always a term applied to community card games (ie holdem, omaha, etc) in which the draws for improvement (regardless whether currently ahead or behind..) become available via the community cards. Purely logistically, rarely do 2 hole cards alone be enough to win a hand (unless betting structure results in table wide folds "pre-community cards"). Redraws are avilable viadonk community cards, and to all. EVERY major hand is assembled with redraws (ie...no 2/4 card holding alone equates to a full house, straight, or flush or better) all came via community cards.