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Is there a general rule when shoving in a sit-and-go? in short stacked situations, how many big blinds would you put in the middle and why?

  • 20 BB or less is typically a push fold situation. – paparazzo Nov 21 '17 at 20:56
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It really depends on the type of sng you're playing and the stack of your opponents. It does not make sense to shove your 10BBs when the table average is 6BBs.

If you're playing a normal sng with a standard slower clock I feel it's pretty correct to play as you would a MTT for your shoving range. However I think you should be a small bit tighter with your range here as it's a SNG so it's often only worth while to win. I.E. your chips have more value because they matter more. Obviously this depends on the structure of the game, but many card rooms I've dealt in have a two place structure for a 10 man sng, with an 80%/20% or 70%/30% split for the payouts.

Given how valuable your chips are, and even if you have 10-15BBs range and our say 4th out of 4, you don't always have to shove because your stack has playing power and can hurt other players. Often a stop and go can be really good move in these situations. I.E. make a bet, with the hope of being raised so you can shove.

Another situation to factor in is the turbo and hyper turbos, again it doesn't make sense to just have an arbitrary figure in your head of "ok I'm on 10BBs I shove". My main point is that I feel in a SNG where the object is to get all the chips to make it worthwhile, you can be tighter on your shoving range because your chips have that much more value.

Better advise to give you rather that giving you a number of xBB would be the following:

  1. Be aware of what the average stack is
  2. Be aware of what your stack represents even if you're behind the average stack (someone losing against your stack could mean they lose so they should be much tighter on calling you)
  3. Be aware of the damage and pressure your stack cause and apply to opponents (similar to point 2)
  4. Be aware of the type of sng (turbos and hyper turbos greatly change what is correct shoving sizes and ranges)
  5. Be aware that a shove might be less scary than a min raise, especially when you have a stack of like 8BB to 10BB when average stack is like 20BB to 25BB (i.e. your min raise is screaming to be raised so you can jam)

The point I'm trying to make is you shouldn't be applying a general rule to a unique situation, analyse what's happening in the game, analyse the impact your stack can cause and make informed decisions from then.

  • I agree with Emphyrio. It does for sure make sense to shove 10BB when your opponents have 6BB. Also, how do your rules affect the maximum amount of BB you shove? You only say be aware of this and that, but not if you should be more tight, or more loose because of it. – Raymond Timmermans Nov 23 '17 at 8:41
  • That's my point, there is no maximum amount of BBs. You cannot apply general rules to unique situations. If it makes sense to shove by your logic go ahead and shove. The conclusions you reach from the advise I'm giving is your own conclusion. You're correct, for sure it does make sense to shove 10BBs into a player on 6BBs, that's not what I said, I said when the average is 6BBs. You're essentially gambling when a 10BB stack could and likely is the chip lead. – Grinch91 Nov 23 '17 at 10:00
  • Of also for the record, I think it's really great you both have different opinions and answers here. It's really nice to see a question with several answers and some discussion. And believe me I'm not saying the numbers you've provided are wrong, they very well maybe the correct sensical sizing for a shove, but again my point is be critical and think of what makes sense rather than applying a generic rule to 100% of your situations. – Grinch91 Nov 23 '17 at 10:24
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It really depends. Under 15BB is almost always a push or a fold. In early position you can shove up to around 18BB. In late position you can shove up to around 20BB. Blind versus blind you can shove up to around 25BB. But these are just general guidelines. You certainly shouldn't shove your entire range for example blind versus blind when you have 25BB, but you could do it with a part of it. It all really depends on the other stacksizes, the payouts, how comfortable you are playing post-flop with certain hands. If you have an insane edge over your opponent it makes sense to not shove sometimes. Great hands should sometimes be trapped, etc.

Note: if there are no antes in play, you shouldn't shove as much big blinds. Around 10BB is usually a push or fold situation. If the antes are huge you can shove more big blinds.

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I disagree with seeveral things in Grinch's post : the fact the average stack is 6BB has no impact on wether you should min raise or open shove your 10bb stack. It only impacts your range, which should be tighter because of $ev. The only valid possible reason to just minraise with 10bb or less effective stack would be to exploit very weak opponents. Otherwise against roughly decent players, push or fold is optimal. If the effective stack (ie taking into account the potential callers stack size but also the antes) is 13bb or less then push or fold is optimal strategy, except against players who fold too much and 3 bet only nuts, or against players who would get induced to shove too loose by a min raise or a limp and other similar purely exploitative reasons. Between 13 and 18bb effective ante included, it s hard to say what is best and which part of the range should be shoved vs which part just opened with small raise. Above 18bb effective, open shoving starts to get silly.

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